Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

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Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:39 am

Why do we continue to allow crazy people have guns? When will we finally pass some common sense gun legislation? Why do I have to live in constant fear of who is carrying a gun around me?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/18/us/fresno-california-shootings/index.html
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Gomezz Adddams on Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:46 am

Dr. Evil wrote:Why do we continue to allow crazy people have guns? When will we finally pass some common sense gun legislation? Why do I have to live in constant fear of who is carrying a gun around me?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/18/us/fresno-california-shootings/index.html

So California allows mental patients and criminals with firearm violations to legally purchase guns? Go figure.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Wed Apr 19, 2017 12:01 pm

Gomezz Adddams wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:Why do we continue to allow crazy people have guns? When will we finally pass some common sense gun legislation? Why do I have to live in constant fear of who is carrying a gun around me?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/18/us/fresno-california-shootings/index.html

So California allows mental patients and criminals with firearm violations to legally purchase guns? Go figure.

I know! Crazy right!?! We need the Federal government to step in where these states refuse so that we can protect our citizens. Wouldn't you agree??
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Gomezz Adddams on Wed Apr 19, 2017 1:30 pm

Dr. Evil wrote:
Gomezz Adddams wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:Why do we continue to allow crazy people have guns? When will we finally pass some common sense gun legislation? Why do I have to live in constant fear of who is carrying a gun around me?

http://www.cnn.com/2017/04/18/us/fresno-california-shootings/index.html

So California allows mental patients and criminals with firearm violations to legally purchase guns? Go figure.

I know! Crazy right!?! We need the Federal government to step in where these states refuse so that we can protect our citizens. Wouldn't you agree??

So you're claiming that California is allowing it's residents to violate Federal background checks by allowing felons with drug and firearms convictions to legally purchase guns? What would "common sense gun legislation" accomplish that existing laws don't?
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Clicker on Wed Apr 19, 2017 2:43 pm

California doesn't allow gun purchases by people with a myriad of offenses, including being accused of domestic violence. I understand that is being extended to those accused of animal abuse as well. If he had a legally purchased gun and was mentally unstable and should have been on the exclusion list, the state screwed up. But then, that's Cali, make a law and then fail to enforce it. They make thousands of new laws then lose track of enforcement.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Skeptical on Wed Apr 19, 2017 3:30 pm


The question was asked, "Why do we continue to allow crazy people have guns?".  There are a lot or articles to be read but, no where is there any mention this person was "allowed" to have a gun.  Considering he did shoot and kill three people he did have possession of a gun.

Perhaps the person who first asked this question on this thread will be kind enough to inform this forum who it was that allowed  Kori Ali Muhammad to have the gun.

I am truly curious how this, "common sense gun legislation" in all its wisdom, would be written, what words would put such fear into those people such as this Fresno shooter  that it would prevent them from ever obtaining a gun whether by legal or illegal means
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Wed Apr 19, 2017 4:00 pm

If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.

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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Clicker on Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:25 pm

Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.

You could dump millions down that rat hole and never find the "responsible" party.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Wed Apr 19, 2017 5:48 pm

Clicker wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.

You could dump millions down that rat hole and never find the "responsible" party.  

You mean like a serial #?
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Skeptical on Wed Apr 19, 2017 6:03 pm

Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.

Please provide the wording of this "common sense gun legislation" you seek that would have prevented this person or any future person from obtaining a gun.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Gomezz Adddams on Wed Apr 19, 2017 7:40 pm

Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.


I'm all for that except that while Obama was president, the justice department failed to prosecute most (95%+) of the applicants who failed their background checks. What purpose will new legislation serve if we aren't enforcing existing laws?
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Wed Apr 19, 2017 9:28 pm

Skeptical wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.

Please provide the wording of this "common sense gun legislation" you seek that would have prevented this person or any future person from obtaining a gun.

First off, you can't 100% prevent anything. Take DUI's for example. We still have people drinking, driving, and dying. That doesn't mean that those laws aren't effective, or that we shouldn't bother trying, or that you should just stick your head in the sand.

Secondly, gun ownership isn't all tin foil and making sure you keep your powder dry. There are responsibilities that come along with gun ownership. One of those responsibilities is making sure that your gun is never used to shoot anybody. Period. That means keeping it under lock and key. That means not giving your crazy kid the key and then taking him to the gun range to practice shooting the kids in his school. That means that when you are protecting your own home by keeping a loaded gun under your pillow, and someone breaks in and steals that gun, you weren't protecting your home in a manner that was safe for those around you. That means, as a gun dealer, not exploiting loopholes in gun laws just because this is 'Murica, and in 'Murica everybody deserves to have a gun.

Third, if you have a pet python that gets out and kills someone, would you be liable?

The law wouldn't have to be rocket science. If the gun is registered to you, you're liable.

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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Gomezz Adddams on Wed Apr 19, 2017 10:07 pm


"If the gun is registered to you". And there we have the answer to the definition of "common sense gun legislation", Gun registration = "common sense gun legislation". Of course this wouldn't have prevented the shooting in Fresno.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Gomezz Adddams on Wed Apr 19, 2017 10:09 pm

"One of those responsibilities is making sure that your gun is never used to shoot anybody." A tad ironic coming from someone who claims he is in support of the Castle Doctrine. Jeebus.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Darth Cheney on Thu Apr 20, 2017 6:12 am

The country of Venezuela recently solved this problem by confiscating all guns and ammo from its citizens. Now the government has given 500,000 outstanding citizens guns that recently have been given the title of militia to quell any resistance. What could possibly go wrong with this scenario?
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Clicker on Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:03 am

Darth Cheney wrote:The country of Venezuela recently solved this problem by confiscating all guns and ammo from its citizens. Now the government has given 500,000 outstanding citizens guns that recently have been given the title of militia to quell any resistance. What could possibly go wrong with this scenario?

This sort of thing is why we have The Second amendment.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:44 am

Darth Cheney wrote:The country of Venezuela recently solved this problem by confiscating all guns and ammo from its citizens. Now the government has given 500,000 outstanding citizens guns that recently have been given the title of militia to quell any resistance. What could possibly go wrong with this scenario?

Venezuela is a mess. Period.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:47 am

Gomezz Adddams wrote:"One of those responsibilities is making sure that your gun is never used to shoot anybody."  A tad ironic coming from someone who claims he is in support of the Castle Doctrine. Jeebus.

That would be the only exception. Just try not to shoot your kids when they throw you a surprise birthday party. But then again that's up to you.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Thu Apr 20, 2017 8:49 am

Gomezz Adddams wrote:
"If the gun is registered to you".   And there we have the answer to the definition of  "common sense gun legislation",  Gun registration = "common sense gun legislation". Of course this wouldn't have prevented the shooting in Fresno.

As I said nothing is 100% bur I'd like to hear your reasoning.
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Gomezz Adddams on Thu Apr 20, 2017 9:45 am

Dr. Evil wrote:
Gomezz Adddams wrote:
"If the gun is registered to you".   And there we have the answer to the definition of  "common sense gun legislation",  Gun registration = "common sense gun legislation". Of course this wouldn't have prevented the shooting in Fresno.

As I said nothing is 100% bur I'd like to hear your reasoning.

Mandatory gun registration laws by their very nature are only aimed at the law abiding gun owner. Felons, mentally incompetent persons and persons not legally allowed to possess firearms have 5th amendment self incrimination protection from prosecution for violating gun registration laws as determined in US vs Freed and Haynes vs US.

A registration list is also considered by many as just one step closer to the outright banning of firearms
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Skeptical on Thu Apr 20, 2017 10:02 am

Dr. Evil wrote:
Skeptical wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.

Please provide the wording of this "common sense gun legislation" you seek that would have prevented this person or any future person from obtaining a gun.

First off, you can't 100% prevent anything. Take DUI's for example. We still have people drinking, driving, and dying. That doesn't mean that those laws aren't effective, or that we shouldn't bother trying, or that you should just stick your head in the sand.

Secondly, gun ownership isn't all tin foil and making sure you keep your powder dry. There are responsibilities that come along with gun ownership. One of those responsibilities is making sure that your gun is never used to shoot anybody. Period. That means keeping it under lock and key. That means not giving your crazy kid the key and then taking him to the gun range to practice shooting the kids in his school. That means that when you are protecting your own home by keeping a loaded gun under your pillow, and someone breaks in and steals that gun, you weren't protecting your home in a manner that was safe for those around you. That means, as a gun dealer, not exploiting loopholes in gun laws just because this is 'Murica, and in 'Murica everybody deserves to have a gun.

Third, if you have a pet python that gets out and kills someone, would you be liable?

The law wouldn't have to be rocket science. If the gun is registered to you, you're liable.


What exactly is the sole purpose of your "Common Sense Gun Legislation", come on, spill the beans, what are you after?

How will your "Common Sense Gun Legislation" supposedly prevent any person who shouldn't legally have a gun from illegally obtaining a gun without affecting legal gun owners, such as putting restrictions/requirements on the gun owners ?
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Jammer on Thu Apr 20, 2017 2:23 pm

Skeptical wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:
Skeptical wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.

Please provide the wording of this "common sense gun legislation" you seek that would have prevented this person or any future person from obtaining a gun.

First off, you can't 100% prevent anything. Take DUI's for example. We still have people drinking, driving, and dying. That doesn't mean that those laws aren't effective, or that we shouldn't bother trying, or that you should just stick your head in the sand.

Secondly, gun ownership isn't all tin foil and making sure you keep your powder dry. There are responsibilities that come along with gun ownership. One of those responsibilities is making sure that your gun is never used to shoot anybody. Period. That means keeping it under lock and key. That means not giving your crazy kid the key and then taking him to the gun range to practice shooting the kids in his school. That means that when you are protecting your own home by keeping a loaded gun under your pillow, and someone breaks in and steals that gun, you weren't protecting your home in a manner that was safe for those around you. That means, as a gun dealer, not exploiting loopholes in gun laws just because this is 'Murica, and in 'Murica everybody deserves to have a gun.

Third, if you have a pet python that gets out and kills someone, would you be liable?

The law wouldn't have to be rocket science. If the gun is registered to you, you're liable.


What exactly is the sole purpose of your "Common Sense Gun Legislation", come on, spill the beans, what are you after?

How will your "Common Sense Gun Legislation" supposedly prevent any person who shouldn't legally have a gun from illegally obtaining a gun without affecting legal gun owners, such as putting restrictions/requirements on the gun owners ?

YOU CAN’T END EVIL BY COMMUNICATING WITH IT
YOU CAN ONLY ERADICATE EVIL BY SILENCING IT
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:48 pm

Gomezz Adddams wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:
Gomezz Adddams wrote:
"If the gun is registered to you".   And there we have the answer to the definition of  "common sense gun legislation",  Gun registration = "common sense gun legislation". Of course this wouldn't have prevented the shooting in Fresno.

As I said nothing is 100% bur I'd like to hear your reasoning.

Mandatory gun registration laws by their very nature are only aimed at the law abiding gun owner. Felons, mentally incompetent persons and persons not legally allowed to possess firearms have 5th amendment self incrimination protection from prosecution for violating gun registration laws as determined in US vs Freed and Haynes vs US.

A registration list is also considered by many as just one step closer to the outright banning of firearms

I'm not sure what either of these cases has to do with someone giving a gun to someone who can't legally have one, except to reinforce the fact that he cannot legally accept the gun.

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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Dr. Evil on Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:50 pm

Gomezz Adddams wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:If he didn't own his gun legally, then we need to find out who illegally gave him one or who was negligent in him acquiring one, and prosecute them right along with him.


I'm all for that except that while Obama was president, the justice department failed to prosecute most (95%+) of the applicants who failed their background checks. What purpose will new legislation serve if we aren't enforcing existing laws?

Haynes vs US?
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Re: Black Mental Patient Kills White People in Fresno CA

Post  Skeptical on Thu Apr 20, 2017 7:59 pm

Dr. Evil wrote:
Gomezz Adddams wrote:
Dr. Evil wrote:
Gomezz Adddams wrote:
"If the gun is registered to you".   And there we have the answer to the definition of  "common sense gun legislation",  Gun registration = "common sense gun legislation". Of course this wouldn't have prevented the shooting in Fresno.

As I said nothing is 100% bur I'd like to hear your reasoning.

Mandatory gun registration laws by their very nature are only aimed at the law abiding gun owner. Felons, mentally incompetent persons and persons not legally allowed to possess firearms have 5th amendment self incrimination protection from prosecution for violating gun registration laws as determined in US vs Freed and Haynes vs US.

A registration list is also considered by many as just one step closer to the outright banning of firearms

I'm not sure what either of these cases has to do with someone giving a gun to someone who can't legally have one,  except to reinforce the fact that he cannot legally accept the gun.

I say old chap ... are you claiming somebody "gave the gun" to the Fresno shooter?   I have read a few articles and none mentioned how or where he obtained a gun, just that he did use one .. a .357 IIRC.

If you have a reliable source that states he was given the gun by a person who knew he was not supposed to possess a gun, by all means post that link.
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